2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Are you a seasoned hiker, or just starting out? Let us know your questions or experience with the backcountry permit process.

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PeteE
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by PeteE »

Does anyone have any experience with "Brownies" hostel? It WOULD be nice to stay somewhere with a shower if possible, at least at the end of the trip.
Brownies is OK but likely to be crowded.
If all you want is a shower, You can get a shower token for a few bucks at Swiftcurrent Inn store, or at the store at Rising Sun.
No need to drive to Brownies imo.
Showers go about 6-8 minutes at token operated showers. KOA no limit on time if you're a guest. Swimming pool and hot tub as well at the KOA.

I would agree about getting a reservation at KOA, or Johnson's CG across the road from KOA, or somewhere, and do it NOW.
You're coming at peak of the season. It will be very difficult to impossible to get a place to stay without a reservation.
Neither KOA nor Johnson's are expensive. Johnson's was about $30/night for a tent spot. KOA is in the $30's I think, but a nicer.
KOA has a store, showers(free if staying there), hot tub, pool, and coin laundry for clothes.

Regarding side trips...
MOL is just a short hike from GLF.
So you'll have plenty of time to go up to Margaret Lake if you are OK doing a little bushwhacking.
Margaret Lake is well worth doing if you can do it.
And even if you don't go all the way to the lake(about 1 1/2 miles I think) you can get up to the falls below the lake.
The falls will be spectacular this year the last week of July.

An alternative would be hike up to Stoney Indian Pass from MOL.

Beautiful country. You did good :)

pete :wink:

PS
I've never had any privacy problems with any of the places I mentioned. 8)
"If you are not curious, you will learn nothing" -Goethe-

"When you're born in this world, you're given a ticket to the freak show.
And when you're born in America, you're given a front row seat."

George Carlin
orin
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by orin »

I wasn't able to reserve anything at a lodge or car campsite for the nights before or after.... I assume there's no way I could get a room at one of the lodges at this
Actually there is a good chance you could still find something. People cancel reservations all the time. But you do have to check online or call them repeatedly.
mfster
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by mfster »

sbosecker wrote:When I came down the stairs I told the lady behind the counter that that was the best two dollars I had spent in a long time.
I bet! And good to know.
orin wrote:Actually there is a good chance you could still find something. People cancel reservations all the time. But you do have to check online or call them repeatedly.
Good to know, I'll keep an eye out!
PeteE wrote: Brownies is OK but likely to be crowded.
If all you want is a shower, You can get a shower token for a few bucks at Swiftcurrent Inn store, or at the store at Rising Sun.
No need to drive to Brownies imo.
Showers go about 6-8 minutes at token operated showers. KOA no limit on time if you're a guest. Swimming pool and hot tub as well at the KOA.

I would agree about getting a reservation at KOA, or Johnson's CG across the road from KOA, or somewhere, and do it NOW.
You're coming at peak of the season. It will be very difficult to impossible to get a place to stay without a reservation.
Neither KOA nor Johnson's are expensive. Johnson's was about $30/night for a tent spot. KOA is in the $30's I think, but a nicer.
KOA has a store, showers(free if staying there), hot tub, pool, and coin laundry for clothes.

Regarding side trips...
MOL is just a short hike from GLF.
So you'll have plenty of time to go up to Margaret Lake if you are OK doing a little bushwhacking.
Margaret Lake is well worth doing if you can do it.
And even if you don't go all the way to the lake(about 1 1/2 miles I think) you can get up to the falls below the lake.
The falls will be spectacular this year the last week of July.

An alternative would be hike up to Stoney Indian Pass from MOL.
Thanks Pete, this is super helpful! I made a reservation at Johnson's since it was $30/night for a tent spot versus $50 at KOA.

Margaret Lake sounds great so I'll definitely try to do that!

Any ideas about Ptarmigan versus Helen Lake from Elizabeth Lake?
PeteE
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by PeteE »

Any ideas about Ptarmigan versus Helen Lake from Elizabeth Lake?
You're welcome! :)

I would hike up to the Ptarmigan Tunnel. it's a grind going up, but I suspect you'll be up for it! 8)
Great views of the surrounding area from up there plus getting to see first hand the tunnel itself which is of historical significance.
If the weather is lousy prohibiting good distant views, Helen Lake might be a better choice.

Regarding Johnson's
I stay at Johnson's when I go to the East side.
So if you don't need all the "amenities" that KOA offers, Johnson's will work fine for you.

http://johnsonsofstmary.squarespace.com/artists/

It's not fancy but they do have showers with plenty of hot water.
They also have a small laundry room. WiFi is pretty slow but will work for emails.
Same folks run the restaurant and motel there. Good food imo at the restaurant.

pete :wink:
"If you are not curious, you will learn nothing" -Goethe-

"When you're born in this world, you're given a ticket to the freak show.
And when you're born in America, you're given a front row seat."

George Carlin
mfster
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by mfster »

PeteE wrote: I would hike up to the Ptarmigan Tunnel. it's a grind going up, but I suspect you'll be up for it! 8)
Great views of the surrounding area from up there plus getting to see first hand the tunnel itself which is of historical significance.
If the weather is lousy prohibiting good distant views, Helen Lake might be a better choice.
Sounds great, thanks for the advice!!
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by PeteE »

You could do both Helen Lake and Ptarmigan tunnel.
Leave your car at Swiftcurrent after picking up your permit.
Hitch to Chief Mountain. It wouldn't be hard.
Then exit from Elizabeth Lake on your last day via the Ptarmigan Tunnel back to Swiftcurrent.
See if you can get ELF as your last night when you pick up permit. Make that last day.

pete :wink:
"If you are not curious, you will learn nothing" -Goethe-

"When you're born in this world, you're given a ticket to the freak show.
And when you're born in America, you're given a front row seat."

George Carlin
mfster
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by mfster »

PeteE wrote:You could do both Helen Lake and Ptarmigan tunnel.
Leave your car at Swiftcurrent after picking up your permit.
Hitch to Chief Mountain. It wouldn't be hard.
Then exit from Elizabeth Lake on your last day via the Ptarmigan Tunnel back to Swiftcurrent.
See if you can get ELF as your last night when you pick up permit. Make that last day.

pete :wink:
I thought I couldn't stay at ELF more than one night? Or are you saying to switch the second to last night to ELH and then the last night to ELF?

Would it really be that easy to hitch to Chief Mountain? I was kind of worried about having to rely on that and then not getting a ride (or it taking a long time to get one)!
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by PeteE »

Yeah, sorry I should have made that suggestion more clear.
Consider swapping ELH for ELF when you pickup your permit.
That would be a change out a few days so it might be available and work.
A possible downside if you do make that switch.
ELH adds 1.6 miles to the walk in from MOL making that day 11.4miles.
Not a big deal because there's not much elevation change between MOL and ELH.

I believe you'll like exiting via the tunnel much better than retracing your route to Chief Mountain.

As for hitchhiking...
I understand people's reluctance to hitch in today's world.
One word of caution about hitching from Swiftcurrent to Chief Mountain---and I would give this advice to everyone.
Make sure your ride is non stop to Chief Mountain. Do not accept a ride that lets you out in Babb and you have to look for a second hitch.
You don't want to be standing on US89 anywhere looking for a ride.

Keep in mind that there will likely be other parties beginning a trip from Chief Mountain same day as you.
You could check at a permit office the day before. They won't tell you "who" but you may see them the morning of pickup.

I know all this sounds "unconventional" but stuff like this happens here in GNP.

So if not for you, others reading this thread may be interested.

pete :wink:
"If you are not curious, you will learn nothing" -Goethe-

"When you're born in this world, you're given a ticket to the freak show.
And when you're born in America, you're given a front row seat."

George Carlin
mfster
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by mfster »

PeteE wrote: A possible downside if you do make that switch.
ELH adds 1.6 miles to the walk in from MOL making that day 11.4miles.
Not a big deal because there's not much elevation change between MOL and ELH.

Keep in mind that there will likely be other parties beginning a trip from Chief Mountain same day as you.
You could check at a permit office the day before. They won't tell you "who" but you may see them the morning of pickup.
I'm planning on driving from Calgary the day before the start of the trip so I don't think I'll be in Glacier in time to pick up permits the day before, so I'll probably have to pick them up the morning of the trip. But I'll see if switching works out! If not do you think ELH out Swiftcurrent would be too big of a day?
PeteE
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by PeteE »

mfster wrote:
PeteE wrote: A possible downside if you do make that switch.
ELH adds 1.6 miles to the walk in from MOL making that day 11.4miles.
Not a big deal because there's not much elevation change between MOL and ELH.

Keep in mind that there will likely be other parties beginning a trip from Chief Mountain same day as you.
You could check at a permit office the day before. They won't tell you "who" but you may see them the morning of pickup.
I'm planning on driving from Calgary the day before the start of the trip so I don't think I'll be in Glacier in time to pick up permits the day before, so I'll probably have to pick them up the morning of the trip. But I'll see if switching works out! If not do you think ELH out Swiftcurrent would be too big of a day?
I see.
Well this idea may not work out this time.
Perhaps in the months ahead you can hook up with someone for a key swap or some other private transport--and avoid the hitching issue.
There's a lot of trips that begin and end at Chief Mountain and Swiftcurrent.
You might want to check back here from time to time. Same with other similar forums.
Not much to do until July anyway, right? 8)

Regarding hiking from ELF to Swiftcurrent.
Same distance out as going to Chief Mtn. with about twice the elv gain. So...
True, it's a bit of a grind up to the tunnel but all down hill from then on with a nice break to cool your feet at Ptarmigan falls. :)

pete :wink:

PS
If you, or anyone reading this, decides to hitchhike...
Make a nice neat sign on a white 8 1/2" x 11'' paper.
Use large as possible block letters.
I laminate my signs. Fit nicely in with bladder in my packs.
A one gallon ZipLoc works well too.

Chief Mountain
Please


Center "Please" under Chief Mountain

No smileys, etc.

Do not scrawl a sign on brown cardboard with a Sharpie---unless you want to stand out in the sun all day.
Stand where the vehicle has room to safely pull over to pick you up after passing you.
Hold the sign where the driver can see it clearly.
And don't be shy. Get that thumb up and out there where it can be seen.
:)
"If you are not curious, you will learn nothing" -Goethe-

"When you're born in this world, you're given a ticket to the freak show.
And when you're born in America, you're given a front row seat."

George Carlin
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by mfster »

Got it! Thanks for the advice, Pete!
BombDiggityNate
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by BombDiggityNate »

It finally came! Second choice itinerary and they shifted my dates two days earlier, but I got in so I can't complain too much. Timestamp was 10:08:00 and I got booted twice, if that means anything anymore. Pretty similar to the itinerary that mfster and pete have been discussing, so I've been following along with that, thanks you two!

ENTER - CHIEF MOUNTAIN (TRAILHEAD)

8-23-2018 - GLF - GLENNS FOOT
Fires; NO
Segment; Length 10.30
Elevation; Up 277 | Down 744

8-24-2018 - KOO - KOOTENAI LK
Fires; YES
Segment; Length 14.00
Elevation; Up 2448 | Down 2975

8-25-2018 - MOL - MOKOWANIS LK
Fires; NO
Segment; Length 12.10
Elevation; Up 3055 | Down 2410

8-26-2018 - GAB - GABLE CREEK
Fires; YES
Segment; Length 8.30
Elevation; Up 0 | Down 280

EXIT - CHIEF MOUNTAIN (TRAILHEAD)
Segment; Length 6.00
Elevation; Up 744 | Down 115


TOTALS;
Trip length 50.70 miles
Elevation up 6,524 feet
Elevation down 6,524 feet
PeteE
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by PeteE »

BombDiggityNate wrote:It finally came! Second choice itinerary and they shifted my dates two days earlier, but I got in so I can't complain too much. Timestamp was 10:08:00 and I got booted twice, if that means anything anymore. Pretty similar to the itinerary that mfster and pete have been discussing, so I've been following along with that, thanks you two!

You're welcome!
And now that "you're in" so to speak 8)
You might consider a couple changes when you pick up your permit---if you want, and they are available.
You'll be going essentially "down hill" the first day.
So try to get GLF changed to GLH(preferred) or even MOJ.
Yes, that adds 2.6 miles or 3.1 miles respectively to 10.3
However, that would make your day 2 much easier.
13 miles down hill is not so bad.
A 14 mile day over Stoney Indian Pass will be a long day.

Coming out COS might be nicer than Gable Creek, but makes for a longer last day back up the hill to Chief Mtn.

pete :wink:

ENTER - CHIEF MOUNTAIN (TRAILHEAD)

8-23-2018 - GLF - GLENNS FOOT
Fires; NO
Segment; Length 10.30
Elevation; Up 277 | Down 744

8-24-2018 - KOO - KOOTENAI LK
Fires; YES
Segment; Length 14.00
Elevation; Up 2448 | Down 2975

8-25-2018 - MOL - MOKOWANIS LK
Fires; NO
Segment; Length 12.10
Elevation; Up 3055 | Down 2410

8-26-2018 - GAB - GABLE CREEK
Fires; YES
Segment; Length 8.30
Elevation; Up 0 | Down 280

EXIT - CHIEF MOUNTAIN (TRAILHEAD)
Segment; Length 6.00
Elevation; Up 744 | Down 115


TOTALS;
Trip length 50.70 miles
Elevation up 6,524 feet
Elevation down 6,524 feet
"If you are not curious, you will learn nothing" -Goethe-

"When you're born in this world, you're given a ticket to the freak show.
And when you're born in America, you're given a front row seat."

George Carlin
BombDiggityNate
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by BombDiggityNate »

You're welcome!
And now that "you're in" so to speak 8)
You might consider a couple changes when you pick up your permit---if you want, and they are available.
You'll be going essentially "down hill" the first day.
So try to get GLF changed to GLH(preferred) or even MOJ.
Yes, that adds 2.6 miles or 3.1 miles respectively to 10.3
However, that would make your day 2 much easier.
13 miles down hill is not so bad.
A 14 mile day over Stoney Indian Pass will be a long day.

Coming out COS might be nicer than Gable Creek, but makes for a longer last day back up the hill to Chief Mtn.

pete :wink:

Thanks for the tip on Head vs Foot. We were thinking on Day 1 we'd take the "long way" to Glenns Lake Foot by making a side trip down to Dawn Mist Falls before angling back up towards Cosley. If we do indeed have the option of changing our first night to Glenns Lake Head and still do the side-trip, that puts Day 1 at 14.4 mi., but like you say, a shorter Day 2 when we have to tackle Stoney Indian Pass. My questions is, would that side-trip to the falls be worth it? I don't exactly have the opportunity to get to Glacier, or anywhere far from Minnesota, all that often, so I'd like to fit as many "must sees" as I can into this trip, but also don't want to tire myself out too much on Day 1.

That being said, are there any other prominent points we should detour from our main route in order to see more highlights along our trip? Our Day 4 is only 8.3 mi. from Mokowanis Lake to Gable Creek, so I was thinking we could head up to Bear Mtn Overlook that day. Thoughts? And thanks so much, again.
BombDiggityNate
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Re: 2018 Backcountry Permit Buzz

Post by BombDiggityNate »

And apparently I also don't know how to properly use the quote feature. Sorry about that.
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